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[sellaz32]

Really enjoying this discussion! This is something I've thought about quite a bit, especially given my work as a therapist. I heard recently the definition of anxiety is a "disturbed relationship with certainty." In my mind, GTD is about being prepared enough to be present or "appropriately engaged in moment." Planning, on the other hand has an expectation or maybe even a "desire for certainty" which can often lead to more thinking, more stress, and more tension.

Uncertainty is not a problem, it is trying to be certain that creates problems, especially given a world with unknown variables.

I like this quote from Oliver Burkeman in Meditations for Mortals: Four Weeks to Embrace Your Limitations and Make Time for What Counts: "What is worry, at its core, but the activity of a mind attempting to picture every single bridge that might possibly have to be crossed in the future, then trying to figure out how to cross it? The compulsive and repetitious character of worry arises from the fact that for finite humans, this goal is doubly impossible. Firstly, we can’t possibly think of every challenge we might end up facing. Secondly, even if we could, the solace we crave could only come from knowing we’d made it safely over the bridges in question – which we can’t ever know until we’ve actually crossed them."

It certainly doesn't hurt to identify some future next steps in planning a project, but be aware the further out you plan, the chances of extra work increase later. My sister n law is a notorious "pre-crastinator" and gets stuff done so far ahead that she often has to redo.

My point isn't that GTD is anti-planning—it’s anti-illusion of certainty. The "planning" exists to define the very next action, not to conquer the unknown future.

Given the infinite complexities of being a human being plus the various professions and contexts in which we want to get things done in the world, GTD provides the flexibility to meet you at whatever level to point you in the direction of clarity or a "mind like water" if you will.

 

[gtd solo-studente]

Really enjoying this discussion! This is something I've thought about quite a bit, especially given my work as a therapist. I heard recently the definition of anxiety is a "disturbed relationship with certainty." In my mind, GTD is about being prepared enough to be present or "appropriately engaged in moment." Planning, on the other hand has an expectation or maybe even a "desire for certainty" which can often lead to more thinking, more stress, and more tension.

Uncertainty is not a problem, it is trying to be certain that creates problems, especially given a world with unknown variables.

I like this quote from Oliver Burkeman in Meditations for Mortals: Four Weeks to Embrace Your Limitations and Make Time for What Counts: "What is worry, at its core, but the activity of a mind attempting to picture every single bridge that might possibly have to be crossed in the future, then trying to figure out how to cross it? The compulsive and repetitious character of worry arises from the fact that for finite humans, this goal is doubly impossible. Firstly, we can’t possibly think of every challenge we might end up facing. Secondly, even if we could, the solace we crave could only come from knowing we’d made it safely over the bridges in question – which we can’t ever know until we’ve actually crossed them."

It certainly doesn't hurt to identify some future next steps in planning a project, but be aware the further out you plan, the chances of extra work increase later. My sister n law is a notorious "pre-crastinator" and gets stuff done so far ahead that she often has to redo.

My point isn't that GTD is anti-planning—it’s anti-illusion of certainty. The "planning" exists to define the very next action, not to conquer the unknown future.

Given the infinite complexities of being a human being plus the various professions and contexts in which we want to get things done in the world, GTD provides the flexibility to meet you at whatever level to point you in the direction of clarity or a "mind like water" if you will.

@sellaz32

Great addition to the GTD discussion

While kindly did delivered a good chuckle, your good "pre-crastinator" sister-in-law sounds like a very caring women

On this end, "pre-crastinator", thank you very much for the Area-of-Focus contributors':

Increased saboteuring awareness for Health
Decrease Project planning for increased GTD proficiency practice

Thank you sir

 

[Oogiem]

Out of curiosity — how often do your multi-year sequences stay stable without major re-design? Genuinely asking, because if that’s still the case for you, it’s extremely valuable to understand what conditions make that possible.

um.. Nearly always.

I just did a quick review of my current projects. I currently have 112 active current projects. Of those there are 8 that are multi-year projects. I just pulled their project planning notes. None of them have had any changes in the basic structure or next actions since I originally planned them. The longest running one right now was started in July 2005. The last major update to the plan was done in 2019. It was to change the resolution of the files I am creating. So not a change in project structure or even in the next action but a change in the technology used to take advantage of improved computer hardware. That's the only one that has any major changes. The other long ones are short in years (start dates from 2010-2020) but have had no changes to anything since started. They just are moving very slowly to completion.

Conditions that make that possible:
1. If they are ones I initiated I spend a LOT of time planning the projects, doing a few prototypes to test my assumptions, structure and plan of attack before committing to a plan to do them. That works for everything from building fences to remodeling a house or a barn to writing code.
2. Then I DOCUMENT my findings. What worked, what didn’t, what I want to change, how that affects the overall plan and more. Those used to be all on paper. Then there is a batch of them that are hybrid, mostly paper some electronic pieces. All the new ones are now electronic.
2 If they are ones I did not initiate, I had the benefit of copious notes on what would or would not work from my mother before me so even though she never realized the long term plan for the farm based on trials and experiments and there was enough structure there that over the last 27 years we've been able to do most everything that was in the original plans from 1973-1977.
3. I keep vast volumes of notes, documents, books, and other info. For example I have over 160,000 archived emails going back over 20 years that provide good references for some of these projects. I have books from the late 1800's to 1940's that I refer to constantly and have notes from my mother and my own about those books that are still useful.
4. I have boxes and boxes of paper files and info. I do wish more of it was scanned or retyped into plain text digital form but they are well enough organized that I can usually find what I am looking for even if I have only a vague memory of it from 30 years ago. I can often recall the position in a box and get within 3 inches of the paper I need as long as I find the correct box. I have the boxes labeled by the years they cover so that helps.
5. When I make a change in technology I take the time to convert all my electronic files to the new format or operating system or whatever the change requires. That includes implementing better systems for storage, recall and access of digital files.
6. In the end farming is still at the pace of nature and that hasn’t changed in tens of thousands of years.

That said, I find that even computer projects, if properly planned, do not have drastic changes over their lifetime unless there is a drastic change in scope, requirements or available technology.

 

[Oogiem]

I don't believe that you've already planned @errands Next Action "Buy 10 pounds od nine inch nails" because you want to build a barn in 2033

Well actually, we have done things like buy 15 pieces of steel i-beam now when we only need 5 for the current project but we know we want to do this other project in 4-10 years. Some of it is sitting the shop right now. So yeah I DO have next actions that relate to very long term outcomes.

Everything beyond the “one true” Next Action lives safely in project support (the backlog).

That does NOT work for me. If I only put a single next action for a project on my lists I'd never get anything done. I put all actions that can be done in parallel on my action lists by context. I'm also ok with actions sitting there for days, weeks or months. I'm even ok with I never got in the right context dueing the season I could do that so at my quarterly reset they go out and I'll pick that project up in a year.

It certainly doesn't hurt to identify some future next steps in planning a project, but be aware the further out you plan, the chances of extra work increase later.

Not necessarily true. The more I plan in advance the faster and easier it is to get the project done. Often there is a huge cost savings too. Especially if the projects require raw materials.

 

[Y_Lherieau]

um.. Nearly always.

I just did a quick review of my current projects. I currently have 112 active current projects. Of those there are 8 that are multi-year projects. I just pulled their project planning notes. None of them have had any changes in the basic structure or next actions since I originally planned them. The longest running one right now was started in July 2005. The last major update to the plan was done in 2019. It was to change the resolution of the files I am creating. So not a change in project structure or even in the next action but a change in the technology used to take advantage of improved computer hardware. That's the only one that has any major changes. The other long ones are short in years (start dates from 2010-2020) but have had no changes to anything since started. They just are moving very slowly to completion.

Conditions that make that possible:
1. If they are ones I initiated I spend a LOT of time planning the projects, doing a few prototypes to test my assumptions, structure and plan of attack before committing to a plan to do them. That works for everything from building fences to remodeling a house or a barn to writing code.
2. Then I DOCUMENT my findings. What worked, what didn’t, what I want to change, how that affects the overall plan and more. Those used to be all on paper. Then there is a batch of them that are hybrid, mostly paper some electronic pieces. All the new ones are now electronic.
2 If they are ones I did not initiate, I had the benefit of copious notes on what would or would not work from my mother before me so even though she never realized the long term plan for the farm based on trials and experiments and there was enough structure there that over the last 27 years we've been able to do most everything that was in the original plans from 1973-1977.
3. I keep vast volumes of notes, documents, books, and other info. For example I have over 160,000 archived emails going back over 20 years that provide good references for some of these projects. I have books from the late 1800's to 1940's that I refer to constantly and have notes from my mother and my own about those books that are still useful.
4. I have boxes and boxes of paper files and info. I do wish more of it was scanned or retyped into plain text digital form but they are well enough organized that I can usually find what I am looking for even if I have only a vague memory of it from 30 years ago. I can often recall the position in a box and get within 3 inches of the paper I need as long as I find the correct box. I have the boxes labeled by the years they cover so that helps.
5. When I make a change in technology I take the time to convert all my electronic files to the new format or operating system or whatever the change requires. That includes implementing better systems for storage, recall and access of digital files.
6. In the end farming is still at the pace of nature and that hasn’t changed in tens of thousands of years.

That said, I find that even computer projects, if properly planned, do not have drastic changes over their lifetime unless there is a drastic change in scope, requirements or available technology.

Where your approach does shine:

Your documentation discipline is world-class. Your archives, your prototypes, the multi-decade continuity — that’s Horizon 3–4 excellence.

But GTD’s structure would simply place it differently in the map.

• H4 → “Multi-year restoration plan for the farm.”
• H3 → “Goals for the next 24 months.”
• H1 → “Projects I can actually complete in the next 12 months.”
• Next Actions → What I can physically do this week.

Nothing in your workflow breaks — it just becomes dramatically easier to review, sequence, and engage.

So no, nothing wrong with your system — but calling multi-decade initiatives “projects” places them at the “uncorrect” altitude in GTD terms.

And when horizons collapse into each other, clarity collapses with them. You’re obviously an outlier in how much long-term stability you can rely on.

But that doesn’t change the GTD definition — it just means your Vision (H4) is more detailed than most.

And that’s a strength… as long as it lives at the right horizon.

 

[gtd solo-studente]

Where your approach does shine:

Your documentation discipline is world-class. Your archives, your prototypes, the multi-decade continuity — that’s Horizon 3–4 excellence.

But GTD’s structure would simply place it differently in the map.

• H4 → “Multi-year restoration plan for the farm.”
• H3 → “Goals for the next 24 months.”
• H1 → “Projects I can actually complete in the next 12 months.”
• Next Actions → What I can physically do this week.

Nothing in your workflow breaks — it just becomes dramatically easier to review, sequence, and engage.

So no, nothing wrong with your system — but calling multi-decade initiatives “projects” places them at the “uncorrect” altitude in GTD terms.

And when horizons collapse into each other, clarity collapses with them. You’re obviously an outlier in how much long-term stability you can rely on.

But that doesn’t change the GTD definition — it just means your Vision (H4) is more detailed than most.

And that’s a strength… as long as it lives at the right horizon.

@Y_Lherieau


Thank you very much for to your good GTD post

On this end, all Horizons are 'embodied' through Organization in order to facilitate optimal dynamic adaptability development through perennial Principles for each Areas-of-Focus' particular Purpose with an all reality proportionately Clarified perspective for all appropriate Engagement(s) as understood through all reality of life parameters for a necessarily robust trustworthy GTD system absent of all doubt, while a partial GTD remains worthy, how else can any comprehensive GTD be truly trustworthy ?

Thus, Someday /Maybe are Remote realities, Projects are Proximate realities, Contexts for Next Actions are Immediate and Intrinsic realities:

All particular Areas-of-Focus are arduously Organized in the following parameters:

E X T E R N A L

E X T R I N S I C <> I N T E R N A L

I N T R I N S I C


Some alphabetical SYSTEMS that might seeming pertain to the above for organization:
Communications
Digital
DIVINE
Enterprise
Eternity
Exercise
Family
Fiscal
HEALTH
Home
Land
Licenses
Opportunity (GTD)*
Nutrition
Passports
Product
PROPS
PROVISIONS
Service
Sleep
Transportation

Further clarifications to the above are most certainly possible for increased GTD system control

*As in an autonomously controlled healthy Opportunity Management System for Mind Like Water

As you see GTD fit. . . .

 

[schmeggahead]

It certainly doesn't hurt to identify some future next steps in planning a project, but be aware the further out you plan, the chances of extra work increase later. My sister n law is a notorious "pre-crastinator" and gets stuff done so far ahead that she often has to redo.

I like your whole post.
This particularly in the aspect of looking too far out increases uncertainty; I trust the weather predictions for the next day or two but every day further is less reliable.

To address this, I capture all of the tasks I happen to think of and think relevant to a project and stash all but one in a list called future actions tagged for the project. In project planning, I move them to action lists and make sure they are clear and still relevant.

Uncertainty is not a problem, it is trying to be certain that creates problems, especially given a world with unknown variables.

Trying to be certain about something that is inherently unpredictable contributes to anxiety.
Making a best guess and knowing the relative margin for error seems to help me in these situations. I anticipate being partially wrong in some way so it isn't surprising when it happens and enjoyable when it doesn't.

Clayton.

Limbic Transfer - Ulysses, It's happening to you right now.