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chinarut
Guest
Purpose
That section is new to me - thanks for sharing your concern. We're starting to go off topic. I'll take responsibility for my use of acronyms without defining them
If anyone else has any concerns, please PM me. I will now clarify my intent for leading this discussion:
this is a first take - input appreciated!
mcogilvie said:
That section is new to me - thanks for sharing your concern. We're starting to go off topic. I'll take responsibility for my use of acronyms without defining them
If anyone else has any concerns, please PM me. I will now clarify my intent for leading this discussion:
- synthesize, integrate, and highlight the merits of each work
- discover a common thread related to each work
- create a space for everyone to collaborate through this common thread
- bring like-minded people together of all walks of life and varying perspectives
this is a first take - input appreciated!
Mission Control and GTD
As mentioned earlier, I think that Mission Control (MC) has much that allows it to resonate with GTD. Both recognize the fundamental truth that you can't get everything done (shown by the use of "someday/maybe" in GTD and "Not doing now/Never doing now" in Mission Control). In MC, this is the foundational idea, while it sits in the background for GTD.
They both rely on the concept of "why would I do this", although, again, it's a bit more up-front with MC. In MC, the description of activities (Next Actions in GTD) are written in past tense describing the outcome purpose for the activities (Projects in GTD).
So, for instance, I wrote, "Increased intimacy and oneness with Terry" for Monday evening dates instead of "Date with Terry". The MC idea being that if I am more fully conscious of ("present" with) my purpose for what I am doing, I am more likely to do it.
Both GTD and MC focus a lot on capture, although I found that GTD was a bit more rigorous in making sure that the brain dump happened and everything was put into the system. This was discussed with MC, but wasn't as critical (from my perpective). MC uses the concept of "now" a bit differently, as in "there is a now when I will be doing this activity". So, in order for the activity to get done, I need to define the "now" in which it will get done, which turns out to be a slot on the calendar at some time. I didn't find this practicable. I find the GTD approach of prioritization in the moment to be far more appropriate for the way my life tends to flow.
Those are my thoughts in the moment.
I'll try to remember to drop back in here periodically and see if I can answer other questions about this.
BTW, Landmark is no big deal, although a lot of people seem to get worked up about it (either in favor or opposition). It introduces a number of very useful perspectives and distinctions that many people never make. However, because of that, some folks seem to latch onto it like it's a religion. I tend not to concern myself which such folks... The Landmark courses I took gave me a number of insights. I may revisit them just to keep some of the concepts current. But, that doesn't make it TRUTH, and Landmark would be the first to tell you that (IME).
As mentioned earlier, I think that Mission Control (MC) has much that allows it to resonate with GTD. Both recognize the fundamental truth that you can't get everything done (shown by the use of "someday/maybe" in GTD and "Not doing now/Never doing now" in Mission Control). In MC, this is the foundational idea, while it sits in the background for GTD.
They both rely on the concept of "why would I do this", although, again, it's a bit more up-front with MC. In MC, the description of activities (Next Actions in GTD) are written in past tense describing the outcome purpose for the activities (Projects in GTD).
So, for instance, I wrote, "Increased intimacy and oneness with Terry" for Monday evening dates instead of "Date with Terry". The MC idea being that if I am more fully conscious of ("present" with) my purpose for what I am doing, I am more likely to do it.
Both GTD and MC focus a lot on capture, although I found that GTD was a bit more rigorous in making sure that the brain dump happened and everything was put into the system. This was discussed with MC, but wasn't as critical (from my perpective). MC uses the concept of "now" a bit differently, as in "there is a now when I will be doing this activity". So, in order for the activity to get done, I need to define the "now" in which it will get done, which turns out to be a slot on the calendar at some time. I didn't find this practicable. I find the GTD approach of prioritization in the moment to be far more appropriate for the way my life tends to flow.
Those are my thoughts in the moment.
I'll try to remember to drop back in here periodically and see if I can answer other questions about this.
BTW, Landmark is no big deal, although a lot of people seem to get worked up about it (either in favor or opposition). It introduces a number of very useful perspectives and distinctions that many people never make. However, because of that, some folks seem to latch onto it like it's a religion. I tend not to concern myself which such folks...
The Landmark courses I took gave me a number of insights. I may revisit them just to keep some of the concepts current. But, that doesn't make it TRUTH, and Landmark would be the first to tell you that (IME).I did not see this before I made my previous post, and it's going to take me a little effort to get my brain around this...chinarut said:
- BEING -> Present to that which is my motivation for action
- ACTION -> Taking action "now" in everything that is a commitment
- RESULTS -> Clarity between what I'm committed to doing and what I am "not doing now" or "never doing now"
It's a swing at it. Not sure if it's accurate.
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chinarut
Guest
the "slot" conversation pokes the thread the most!
wow - this is quite an engaging conversation now - thanks ssh!
this makes sense, in a world of possibility just about everything occurs as an "opening for action!"
huh - interesting observation...I do recall the coach I am in touch with at Mission Control shared this with me - it never did stick (and neither have I completed the course mind you)
ah - now this is an interesting intersection with Franklin-Covey! Franklin requests you declare 7 roles for your life each week and that you "slot" your "big rocks" in your week. I personally cycle back and forth between making a compass and stepping away from it - I can now see MC has cleverly kept an outcome-focus through the way you described scheduled activities. FC desperately tries to link the outcomes back to your roles in life which is what catches my interest the most - it allows for it to be modelled by s/w - esp when you view "requirements management" from a "life requirements" perspective and you have the possibility of being someone who traces their outcomes back to one's mission
excellent point - this is exactly why I do my best to stay current with practices outside of Landmark Education. I choose to strike a balance and be a generalist - thus leading this conversation - thanks for the acknowledgement!
wow - this is quite an engaging conversation now - thanks ssh!
ssh said:
this makes sense, in a world of possibility just about everything occurs as an "opening for action!"
huh - interesting observation...I do recall the coach I am in touch with at Mission Control shared this with me - it never did stick (and neither have I completed the course mind you)
ah - now this is an interesting intersection with Franklin-Covey! Franklin requests you declare 7 roles for your life each week and that you "slot" your "big rocks" in your week. I personally cycle back and forth between making a compass and stepping away from it - I can now see MC has cleverly kept an outcome-focus through the way you described scheduled activities. FC desperately tries to link the outcomes back to your roles in life which is what catches my interest the most - it allows for it to be modelled by s/w - esp when you view "requirements management" from a "life requirements" perspective and you have the possibility of being someone who traces their outcomes back to one's mission
excellent point - this is exactly why I do my best to stay current with practices outside of Landmark Education. I choose to strike a balance and be a generalist - thus leading this conversation - thanks for the acknowledgement!
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chinarut
Guest
Commitment
this is a great first swing - i think you made it to 2nd base!
What i hear in this is distinguishing openings for action that are my commitments vs "ah - that would be nice to do" but not your word [to someone else] - which generally occur quite often!
What have others done to manage "Someday/Maybe" lists that have gotten out of control - getting lengthy and perhaps unwieldy? Is there a point you need to restructure or "flush" the list and create from nothing?
Not intending to go off-topic - I think there is an insight here and to bring FC into the picture - commitments are described as the roles you commit to for your life and the people in your life that keep you accountable to each role.
For example, as a father, I promise my wife I will go see the school play. My wife will clearly get on my case if I do not show up and surely my son will probably say something too! I put this "big rock" in my schedule and I suppose in the spirit of MC - "son shared how great it was to dance in front of everyone"
ssh said:
this is a great first swing - i think you made it to 2nd base!
What i hear in this is distinguishing openings for action that are my commitments vs "ah - that would be nice to do" but not your word [to someone else] - which generally occur quite often!
What have others done to manage "Someday/Maybe" lists that have gotten out of control - getting lengthy and perhaps unwieldy? Is there a point you need to restructure or "flush" the list and create from nothing?
Not intending to go off-topic - I think there is an insight here and to bring FC into the picture - commitments are described as the roles you commit to for your life and the people in your life that keep you accountable to each role.
For example, as a father, I promise my wife I will go see the school play. My wife will clearly get on my case if I do not show up and surely my son will probably say something too! I put this "big rock" in my schedule and I suppose in the spirit of MC - "son shared how great it was to dance in front of everyone"
FYI Mission Control summary, and comparision to GTD
Hey chinarut. FYI I've just posted a detailed description of the Mission Control I attended, plus a comparison to GTD. It's at A GTD-er's perspective on Mission Control's "Productivity and Accomplishment" workshop. I hope you find it useful.chinarut said:
GTD and MPS
What about Sally McGhee' MPS? I have not read the book but I have just had a look at the website. There seems to be a lot similarities between this system and GTD. Is anyone familiar with MPS and could perhaps elaborate on what the two have in common and how do they differ.
What about Sally McGhee' MPS? I have not read the book but I have just had a look at the website. There seems to be a lot similarities between this system and GTD. Is anyone familiar with MPS and could perhaps elaborate on what the two have in common and how do they differ.
re: Sally McGhee
I have the book and I think it's pretty good. Lot's of overlap with GTD. For example, she gets very specific about defining "Next Actions with no dependencies", has a version of mind sweep, a triggers list, the first three phases of work are similar, Collect, Process, and Organize. She mentions in the introduction that she and David Allen actually were partners in a company called, Productivity Development Group and David is quoted and referenced in the index.
Another resource that I've integrated into my own systems is Mahan Khalsa's, "Let's Get Real". It's published by Covey Press. No supporting website that I know of, but the tapes/CD are excellent. One of his many usefull principles in defining outcomes is to stay off solutions until you've identified all the issues. The attraction of shiney solutions, (like the perrenial search for gear, or the GTD holy grail of Projects linked to Next Actions automation that we hear so much of in this forum) are distractions from doing the real executive focuse necessary to discover the scope and breadth of the challenge in front of you. Similar to GTD's asking Why are we having this meeting? What would done look like? etc. It's a really fine piece of work.
Pack Matthews
I have the book and I think it's pretty good. Lot's of overlap with GTD. For example, she gets very specific about defining "Next Actions with no dependencies", has a version of mind sweep, a triggers list, the first three phases of work are similar, Collect, Process, and Organize. She mentions in the introduction that she and David Allen actually were partners in a company called, Productivity Development Group and David is quoted and referenced in the index.
Another resource that I've integrated into my own systems is Mahan Khalsa's, "Let's Get Real". It's published by Covey Press. No supporting website that I know of, but the tapes/CD are excellent. One of his many usefull principles in defining outcomes is to stay off solutions until you've identified all the issues. The attraction of shiney solutions, (like the perrenial search for gear, or the GTD holy grail of Projects linked to Next Actions automation that we hear so much of in this forum) are distractions from doing the real executive focuse necessary to discover the scope and breadth of the challenge in front of you. Similar to GTD's asking Why are we having this meeting? What would done look like? etc. It's a really fine piece of work.
Pack Matthews
L
LJM
Guest
I was brought to a Landmark recruitment meeting (on false pretences) once, and I found it to be freaky and cult-like. The entire time I was there, I felt like I was in a sit-com parody of a freaky-cult-like group recruitment meeting. It was weird-- I kept asking myself am I on Candid Camera?
And they really, really, did the hard-sell. I am immediately distrustful of any group that does a stereotypically used-car-lot style hardsell.
Additionally, anyone who tries to make you think they have exclusive access to The Truth is someone to be very, very suspicious of. ("Seek the truth-- and run like hell from anyone who claims to have found it")
And that was just a meeting a couple hours long. Talking to others, it seems that their major seminars are set up to manipulate you into having an intensely emotional catharsis, and then convince you it's some sort of psychological break-through-- when it's really just a catharsis, like you get from watching an intense movie for entertainment.
The rest of you all can do what you like. Do what makes sense for you. But having seen these people up close and personal, they scare me-- a lot. And there are very, very few people I can say that about: I like to think of myself as being fairly open-minded.
(I know I'm going to sound to some of you like someone on another forum who called GTD freaky and cult-like sounded to me. But so be it. I'm just giving my honest impression.)
And they really, really, did the hard-sell. I am immediately distrustful of any group that does a stereotypically used-car-lot style hardsell.
Additionally, anyone who tries to make you think they have exclusive access to The Truth is someone to be very, very suspicious of. ("Seek the truth-- and run like hell from anyone who claims to have found it")
And that was just a meeting a couple hours long. Talking to others, it seems that their major seminars are set up to manipulate you into having an intensely emotional catharsis, and then convince you it's some sort of psychological break-through-- when it's really just a catharsis, like you get from watching an intense movie for entertainment.
The rest of you all can do what you like. Do what makes sense for you. But having seen these people up close and personal, they scare me-- a lot. And there are very, very few people I can say that about: I like to think of myself as being fairly open-minded.
(I know I'm going to sound to some of you like someone on another forum who called GTD freaky and cult-like sounded to me. But so be it. I'm just giving my honest impression.)
landmark
Hi all,
I have a friend who just published a book on motivational speakers and he did one chapter on Landmark (which he took, and actually liked), and guess what he got the other day? A letter from their lawyer that they were suing him unless he pulled the chapter from further editions--which are in the works. The book is doing well. But boy was his mind blown. And he actually wrote positive stuff about them! They don't want anything written about them, period. Interesting. Just thought I would lob this in. I am an old est-ty from the 70's and I think I did most everything they offered, but that's another story.
Trish
Hi all,
I have a friend who just published a book on motivational speakers and he did one chapter on Landmark (which he took, and actually liked), and guess what he got the other day? A letter from their lawyer that they were suing him unless he pulled the chapter from further editions--which are in the works. The book is doing well. But boy was his mind blown. And he actually wrote positive stuff about them! They don't want anything written about them, period. Interesting. Just thought I would lob this in. I am an old est-ty from the 70's and I think I did most everything they offered, but that's another story.
Trish
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chinarut
Guest
Chinarut's taking Mission Control!
Hello everyone - it's been awhile since replying to this thread - lots of changes in my life here in Thailand - one foremost being I don't spend nearly as much time online as I used to (perhaps on the order of 5-10% now). I have an increased focus on being with those in Thailand and will continue to participate online as it is really great to be with people like those of you reading this thread as I can powerfully relate to many of you - yes, it's a bit of a dance!
Thanks, Matthew, for writing such a detailed capture of your experience with Mission Control! I'm happy to share I am now registered and taking the course on July 28th and really excited!
I've been tackling on inquiring what my fundamental concerns are, a capture tool, and scheduling occasions on my calendar as accomplishments. Of course, without having taken the course, I'm only getting so far but it's fruitful, I've engaged in a conversation with my course leader to be 2 months ago, and really look forward to bringing the challenges I experience to the table much like I did with David Allen's Getting Things Done back in Feb 2003! This I will forever be grateful for - thanks David!
ok - look for updates as August gets nearer and invite everyone to keep this thread going - we really appreciate the many different perspectives and cross-disciplinary nature of many of you bring to the table - thank you!
Chinarut
Hello everyone - it's been awhile since replying to this thread - lots of changes in my life here in Thailand - one foremost being I don't spend nearly as much time online as I used to (perhaps on the order of 5-10% now). I have an increased focus on being with those in Thailand and will continue to participate online as it is really great to be with people like those of you reading this thread as I can powerfully relate to many of you - yes, it's a bit of a dance!
Thanks, Matthew, for writing such a detailed capture of your experience with Mission Control! I'm happy to share I am now registered and taking the course on July 28th and really excited!
I've been tackling on inquiring what my fundamental concerns are, a capture tool, and scheduling occasions on my calendar as accomplishments. Of course, without having taken the course, I'm only getting so far but it's fruitful, I've engaged in a conversation with my course leader to be 2 months ago, and really look forward to bringing the challenges I experience to the table much like I did with David Allen's Getting Things Done back in Feb 2003! This I will forever be grateful for - thanks David!
ok - look for updates as August gets nearer and invite everyone to keep this thread going - we really appreciate the many different perspectives and cross-disciplinary nature of many of you bring to the table - thank you!
Chinarut
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chinarut
Guest
meeting David Allen on June 27th
Hello everyone! I took a moment to reread this thread and realize I didn't follow up in August! I dropped the ball. Now that I've done Mission Control, I get what was missing was creating an occasion on my calendar as an accomplishment at the moment I posted it
It's been nearly a year since completing Mission Control, I thought I'd share what Mission Control is for me. So first things first, about my departure...
After my course, I created an accomplishment in my calendar to be married by Sept 2, 2012 - well - it suffices to say my girlfriend showed up in my life 2 days later and here I am in Tokyo 9 months later! I honestly don't think I can personally top this share...at least not yet
secondly, what brought me back to this thread is to share that I have an opportunity to meet David Allen this Friday, June 27th for the first time since taking his course the day after starting this thread back in Feb 2003.
I look forward (yes, I can hear it as an accomplishment already!) to thanking him for his support in getting my ass to Asia after his workshop back in Feb 2003 using GTD. I also want to take the opportunity to present any lingering thoughts or questions that we may have as a community around bridging MC and GTD - the opportunity is presenting itself no doubt!
thirdly, I'd like to invite everyone to transform what has been an "open inquiry" for what amounts to over 5 years and begin to think about an outcome (or accomplishment!) we would be interested in creating as a group . What would bridging MC + GTD result in? is our discussion just an intellectual exercise or is there some purpose behind it we can create?
I particularly want to thank all of you for engaging in a conversation I had no idea where it would go. I just get my commitment and be happy to propose anything we come up with to David Allen when I see him on friday evening!
To keep the conversation moving, here are two aspects of the conversation I will continue to forward:
(1)
Going to reshape it as this:
(2)
A few months ago, I had short discussion with Matt and he had a great idea to bring some integrity to scheduling all your "next actions" as accomplishments.
I started to experiment with this myself and didn't get too far to be honest - I personally have to reengage with what the community has discovered on the technology front over the past year!
That said, I don't want to transform this into a technology thread unless this is what everyone wants this week!
cheers,
chinarut
Hello everyone! I took a moment to reread this thread and realize I didn't follow up in August! I dropped the ball. Now that I've done Mission Control, I get what was missing was creating an occasion on my calendar as an accomplishment at the moment I posted it
It's been nearly a year since completing Mission Control, I thought I'd share what Mission Control is for me. So first things first, about my departure...
After my course, I created an accomplishment in my calendar to be married by Sept 2, 2012 - well - it suffices to say my girlfriend showed up in my life 2 days later and here I am in Tokyo 9 months later! I honestly don't think I can personally top this share...at least not yet
secondly, what brought me back to this thread is to share that I have an opportunity to meet David Allen this Friday, June 27th for the first time since taking his course the day after starting this thread back in Feb 2003.
I look forward (yes, I can hear it as an accomplishment already!) to thanking him for his support in getting my ass to Asia after his workshop back in Feb 2003 using GTD. I also want to take the opportunity to present any lingering thoughts or questions that we may have as a community around bridging MC and GTD - the opportunity is presenting itself no doubt!
thirdly, I'd like to invite everyone to transform what has been an "open inquiry" for what amounts to over 5 years and begin to think about an outcome (or accomplishment!) we would be interested in creating as a group . What would bridging MC + GTD result in? is our discussion just an intellectual exercise or is there some purpose behind it we can create?
I particularly want to thank all of you for engaging in a conversation I had no idea where it would go. I just get my commitment and be happy to propose anything we come up with to David Allen when I see him on friday evening!
To keep the conversation moving, here are two aspects of the conversation I will continue to forward:
(1)
ssh;37809 said:
Going to reshape it as this:
- BEING -> at peace. committed.
- ACTION -> doing exactly what you said, when u said you'd do it.
- RESULTS -> accomplishments. the unpredictable.
(2)
A few months ago, I had short discussion with Matt and he had a great idea to bring some integrity to scheduling all your "next actions" as accomplishments.
I started to experiment with this myself and didn't get too far to be honest - I personally have to reengage with what the community has discovered on the technology front over the past year!
That said, I don't want to transform this into a technology thread unless this is what everyone wants this week!
cheers,
chinarut