how do you deal with an obsession?

[mystery_man]

This may not be a legit GTD question, but I’ll give it a shot.

I’m obsessed with the world of pick-up. All my life I’ve been a loser when it comes to women. So when I decided to mend this aspect of my life, I stumbled across http://www.themysterymethod.com/forum

And since then, I’ve been stuck. I would read all the post and achieves. And I’d scour the internet for more. I’m not entirely neglecting all the other aspects of my life, because I still have other active projects I’m working on.

But the problem is pick-up has taken a huge chunk of my time. I’ve written down my priorities and areas of focus, so I know in theory what they are. And learning to pick-up isn’t more important than any of them.

But when it gets down to the actual doing, I’d find myself focusing more learning pick up. And other projects are not getting the focus that they deserve. It’s plain and simple wrong. And I know that. I just can’t get myself to extract from this obsession.

My guess is I’m overcompensating for my weakness. The hype would probably wear down in a few months, but I’m not sure.

I tried scheduling. But I would always lose track of time, probably because I’m INFJ. I’ve tried alarms but I’d just ignore them.

This is kind of embarrassing to post, but I’d really appreciate any advice.

 

[Rainer Burmeister]

S C A

Maybe you should contact "Sexual Compulsives Anonymous" http://www.sca-recovery.org and try their 12-step recovery program.

Good luck!

Rainer

 

[Brent]

Thanks for sharing!

There are almost certainly deeper reasons for this behavior of yours, and I think you'd benefit from bringing them out into the light.

My recommendation: Find a therapist you can talk to. Nothing major; just someone with whom you can discuss this in a bit of detail and who can give you some friendly advice.

Best of luck. It can be a scary road at times, but it's worth travelling.

 

[maxleibman]

Put it all into your system!

I agree with the previous two posts, and I would also submit some GTDish thinking...

The reason for your obsession may be that there is an area of focus in your life that either you have not acknowledged or are not giving appropriate attention to--something in the social/emotional/relationship realm, something to do with family or sex life or life goals or self-improvement or interpersonal skills development or somesuch. Approaching a therapist or a group might be a good project or next action for exploring and clarifying such an area.

Also, consider David's words from the last Productive Talk podcast: "If you don't pay attention to what has your attention it'll take more of your attention than it deserves--or, if you don't pay approrpriate attention to it. So, learning to find out, 'What's got my attention? How do I unhook that?' Because it's still the basic truth--it's called, 'The more it's on your mind, the less it's happening.'" In your case, this thing may be getting out of control and happening TOO much for the same reason--because it represents something that hasn't been clarified, that has been allowed to run on an infinite feedback loop in your head until it became deafening.

I find that I often resist putting highly personal, sensitive, or potentially embarrassing things into my system, but that can be almost more dangerous than having no system in the first place. One of more profound things I've noticed is that when my system is incomplete, the things I've left out become huge, inescapable attention-hogs; I free up mental and spiritual resources by getting my worries about work, school, and mundane daily chores off my mind and into my system, but whatever I was too tentative or sheepish to put into the system then takes over all of my newly freed-up energy.

So, again, if this is becoming a serious problem, I don't disagree with the others--seeking help may be the perfect Next Action. But I think it's very possible that the reason the art of the pick-up is getting attention that the "real" areas of focus in your system aren't is that you've put THEM through your process so you don't worry about them, but you've left the pick-up in your head, rather than having an "Improve My Game" project or an appropriate psychological health or social area of focus.

Best of luck!

 

[ceehjay]

Too much energy?

What wonderful posts, but a lot of energy put into responding to spam, don't you think?

Carolyn

 

[ludlow]

Not spam, I reckon.

It would be odd spam: "click on this link and you will develop an obsession and fail to fulfil your other life goals...!"

 

[nancyrezmer]

Improving My Game - SA

From MaxLiebman - "But I think it's very possible that the reason the art of the pick-up is getting attention that the "real" areas of focus in your system aren't is that you've put THEM through your process so you don't worry about them, but you've left the pick-up in your head, rather than having an "Improve My Game" project or an appropriate psychological health or social area of focus."

Thanks for the insight about obsessive thoughts that have not made it into the "Improve My Game" project files. I've been trying to clean out all the "stuff" on my GTD runway - but hadn't realized that being stuck about something that I continuously ruminate over is a project too. I better get my capture tool out to listen to myself when I start "chewing the cud." "Improve My Game" is certainly an affirming title for a project list that identifies the really stuck areas of life.

The original posting sounded like SPAM and I got suspicious too. However, I thought the feedback was really helpful. I've also learned to re-frame SPAM as a reminder to me that sometimes my self-talk is worse than the SPAM. I send ten times more negative Self-Talk Spam to myself than my email account receives.

 

[Brent]

Judging by the first line, I bet it's not spam. And it's a reasonable topic for discussion.

 

[Dave John]

... but why does he include a link?

 

[maxleibman]

The possibility of spam occurred to me, but there was a lot of effort put into framing it in a cogent, topical issue and drafting readable and believable prose; also, no indication that the forum linked to or any other part of his obsession has brought him anything but trouble (or, at least, done anything but wasted his time and troubled him about his priorities).

If it is spam, it is supremely odd spam, and still raises a real enough issue (whether it's real to him or not), so I took at face value. In the event that it is spam, I still enjoyed drafting my reply, and he's clearly putting too much effort into for the response he's going to generate, so it's his loss, not mine.

 

[mystery_man]

I was hesitant at first to post because I’m not sure what kind of reply I’d get or whether I’d actually get a reply, but I said what the heck.

The reason for your obsession may be that there is an area of focus in your life that either you have not acknowledged or are not giving appropriate attention to--something in the social/emotional/relationship realm, something to do with family or sex life or life goals or self-improvement or interpersonal skills development or somesuch.
Best of luck!

I’ve noticed that… in fact I did write it down, but only after I was already hooked. And it’s funny because I used the exact same wording, “Improve my game.” And one of my next actions is: read chapter 2. Now I’d choose that action over other actions – regardless of priorities – which is what’s causing the problem. In addition to that, I’d be reading additional chapters too, and would focus on sarging (a term for picking up) whenever I’m out (even if it isn’t on my @out list, and I’d neglect those that are), so you can see I’m wasting too much time on this.

I’m still technically on vacation because of the holidays, so I can still afford to lag behind on my other projects, although I have this slight squirmy feeling I’m not living up to my priorities.

I don’t think I’m such a bad case that I need therapy, so I’d skip the advice.

I just finished reading the book “The Game” by Neil Strauss, where he described how the subculture of pick-up he got into was in a sense a false reality, which he eventually walked away from.

Now I’m thinking how my mind was clouded by this false reality too, although I still think I need to improve my game, as part of interpersonal skills development. In the back of my mind I knew my purpose of reading the book was to help myself extract from this obsession.

In retrospect, I think the reason I got overly obsessed was because I put it into my system too late. I was already engrossed with PUAs (pick-up artists) before I considered relationships an area of focus and wrote down a project for it, trying to restrict myself to the time constraints set by having to balance all the NAs I have. And apparently it didn’t work. I was so hooked I couldn't take it easy.

I find that I often resist putting highly personal, sensitive, or potentially embarrassing things into my system, but that can be almost more dangerous than having no system in the first place. One of more profound things I've noticed is that when my system is incomplete, the things I've left out become huge, inescapable attention-hogs; I free up mental and spiritual resources by getting my worries about work, school, and mundane daily chores off my mind and into my system, but whatever I was too tentative or sheepish to put into the system then takes over all of my newly freed-up energy.

I couldn’t agree more. My experience was clearly a manifestation of my lack of focus in an area that is important TO ME. I neglected to process it down to my system and it eventually turned into the attention hog you talked about.

I agree that whatever it is, no matter how insignificant it seems, should be captured into the system. Whether it’s social insecurity, childhood fear, past family disputes, or simply a slight misunderstanding with a friend, it is, IMHO, still considered an open loop that needs to be closed. Mine was just a bit too personal, so maybe that’s the reason why some thought it was spam.

Even if some would say GTD’s only function is to help one get things done, and the system wouldn’t care whether it’s to start your own business and have more quality time with your daughter, or to rob banks, pick up women, and ruin your life, I still think simply getting everything out into a system and seeing it all would actually help get one’s life in order.

Thanks for responses, it helped a lot. Typing it out and knowing someone else was reading was kinda therapeutic too. And just for the record, this is not a spam.

 

[darlakbrown]

It is spam. Where did he go if he really wanted advice?

 

[Brent]

I don’t think I’m such a bad case that I need therapy, so I’d skip the advice.

Therapy's not about it being "bad enough." But yes, it's certainly your choice.

 

[maxleibman]

It is spam. Where did he go if he really wanted advice?

He came back and wrote the fairly lengthy response to what we'd suggested that appears right above your question (and, if the timestamps are accurate, he did so about 2 days before your post).

 

[mephisto]

In one way pick-up is about more than getting girls in your bed. It's about improving yourself and your whole life. Been there, done that, and keep looking at it now and then not to revert to becoming an AFC again. The truth is, becoming good at PU requires effort and time. And it's a big project with many subprojects (getting confidence, learning to groom better, voice lessons, body language, NLP, learning how to open, etc).

What made me spend less time with reading all the boards, was to see how everything you do is geared towards improving yourself, and thus be more successful with girls. Eg, instead of just learning the different phases om the MM, also come to see that being a cool guy with good grades attracts girls also. And that when you have a nice job with some financial freedom, you'll have it much easier to create space and place and time for the girls you'll be bringing in.

There nothing wrong with wanting some regular vulcanic activity, but come to see it as a project with subprojects that all need care for the larger project to be successful in the long run.

 

[Jamie Elis]

vulnerability to obsessions/compulsions

At the risk of being wrong because of overgeneralizing, IMHO, people who are atttracted to GTD methodology may tend to be vulnerable to obsessions and/ or compulsions, and that is okay, traits and tendancies in this realm can support a lot of productive work. I think the post is legit, and the responses are thoughtful. I do think that adding the link and the content of the obsession was an unnecessary gambit but it may have reflected a wish that someone would reply who was also attracted to that matter and had experience coping with it. Or, it reflected a desire to make a splash on the site and stir things up. I would be interested in seeing examples of how overcoming an obsession or compulsion was turned into a GTD project and what the next actions were. I don't think a lot of content is needed to explain how one succeeded or failed with this.

 

[mystery_man]

Lack of focus in an area might transform into an obsession, but I’m beginning to see that my case was a lot of different open loops that, weirdly, channeled into this obsession.

My life is short of a wreck. There are times when I’m very goal oriented and confidently cranking down goal-driven NAs. But there are also times when I’m asking myself if I’m living it right.

You see I got into business because of my dad. One of his reasons, as I’m beginning to realize, is he wanted to beat his older brother’s business. They were partners before, but somehow they got into an argument and my dad decided to leave. So he dragged me into this business, right after I graduated. It’s been four years now and the business is still barely scraping by. So now whenever I do my higher altitude reviews, there would be this nagging thought whether or not I did want to have this business. How do you close that open loop?

I had also recently been blown off by this girl I used to date, because my AFC (average frustrated chump) tendencies. And rubbing salt to the wound is my dad. He would keep on asking me to find any girl and get married, so he could rest and leave this wavering business to me and my would-be-wife. That’s just an illustration how he treats my step mom, as if she’s a housemaid. In retaliation, she would not help with the business and would keep on saying it’ll ultimately fail.

So I made a goal in my family area of focus that says “Stronger bonding within the family.” I tried creating *togetherness projects but to no avail. Dad and my step mom would always be arguing about everything, from money to rats on the house. And because the business isn’t doing well, dad’s becoming sort of a miserly old man.

It seems I’m cowering to my dad and his wishes, because I’m financially dependent on him. Although the business is under my name (which I think is the incentive he used to drag me into this, and also a hook to keep me), Dad’s the one who financed it all.

I’m hoping that all these ill feelings and thoughts are simply the effects of having difficult times in the business, so I still have lots of projects to get the business and my family back on track. I recently tried to define my six levels of work and mind-map them into a cohesive structure. I was able to connect my areas of focus (sales, product development, asset management, strategic planning, systems design, health, relationships (friends, and family), personal development and spirituality) to projects and NAs. I still think I can sort this out, although I’m having a hard time ignoring the thought that I didn’t want this in the first place. Maybe that’s one reason I couldn’t get to the three to five year visions or the 50,000 feet level.

 

[kewms]

Running a business is hard enough if it's one that you love. Trying to make a success of something you not only don't want to do, but resent, doesn't seem like a promising path.

So it seems to me that the very first thing on your agenda should be to sort out whether you want to be involved in this business at all, and if not, what to do about it. Without that decision, you're pretty much stuck.

Katherine

 

[Day Owl]

Next in importance after reflecting deeply on your involvement in the business, or quite possibly of equal importance, might be detaching yourself from the problems between your father and your stepmother. As you describe this situation, it sounds very much like the classic pattern of parents being dysfunctional on some level, and the child (or grown-up child, in your case) feeling responsible for fixing it and perhaps even for causing it or helping to cause it. But we can't fix our parents.

And I second what Brent said: You don't have to be in extreme need to take advantage of therapy. In fact, the responsibility you feel toward your parents' problems suggests that you could derive great benefit from therapy. It would help you be less enmeshed in problems not of your making, and it would help you find and use more effective ways of helping them if you choose to do so.

 

[LJM]

I just want to second (third?) what others have said about running a business: it can be very rewarding, but the risk and the amount of work are far to high to waste on something you aren't really interested in, or because someone else wants you to. I think it's a bad idea to try to run a business that you're not passionate about.

I reccomend seriously considering creating a project: "extricate self from family business". Far, far easier said than done, I know-- and I'm sure it would open up a can of worms you'd rather not deal with. But Also think of the cost of staying, and whether where your life will go if you stay is really where you want to be. Also (or at least), perhaps an "investigate other possible ways to earn a living" project.

So I made a goal in my family area of focus that says “Stronger bonding within the family.” I tried creating *togetherness projects but to no avail.

A nobel goal. But experience (my own and watching others) indicates that your chances of changing your family dynamics though your own efforts range from "slim" to "none". As much as we'd all love to transform our families into the kind of family we'd really like to have, we rarely have that choice.

I can see how someone who is lacking that kind of satifying closeness could turn to an obsession with pick-up in an attempt to close that loop-- but whatever effect it may have on your "people skills", the interactions themselves are on too shallow a level to provide that closeness in a genuine and lasting way.

(I've read a theory that "additions" often happen when a substance or activity partially meets a very real need that it can never meet entirely-- thus people turn to more and more of it to try to boost that partial solution. To break the addition, it becomes neccesary to find an alternate means of seeking to meet that need, one that has the possibility of meeting it at a deeper level than the addiction.)

I'd recomend going a level up and creating a project called "find genuine closeness and 'family'". Then think of all the different ways you might pursue it: extended family? Friends? Seeing out people to share common interests with (what were you interested in before you became obsessed with pick-up?)

(I'd reccomend staying away from "seeking a serious relationship" as a way to meet the "genuine closeness" goal for now. First, it might end up just being another way to give in to your father's pressure. Second, you're already trapped in one commitment that you don't want to be in, getting into another too soon won't do any good for you or your hypothetical partener. Don't tell yourself--or anyone else-- that you're ready before you are really, completely comfortable with--and actualy want-- it. Some people choose never to be in a serious relationship and that's fine too: I just think you need to get the rest of your life to where you're basically happy with it before you try to make that decision.)

I'm sure you'll still be pursuing the pick-up thing at the same time, but just be aware that it's part of the "enjoyable ways to spend time" goal and "temporary patch to a larger hole" goal, and that there may be other goals in your life that may well be more important to you.

Hope this helps.