What's the max time for a "Next Action"

This thread is starting to help a REALLY big realization . I have SO many "War and Peace" examples on my lists.

I'm now 40 years old , and finally realizing that i can't do everything. I can only do about 9 projects at a time. 3 Personal Life, 3 Business, 3 in my job.

That is because I have so many maintenance things, things that have to happen daily or weekly or monthly in each of those area's. And my need for some kind of undefined time in my life so i don't loose my mind.

All of this means, my worst fears are true, that I can't do it all. All those dream project I keep trying to shove into my calendar, I'll never get to do.

So they all have to go on my someday maybe list. But that list is already so long I can't possibly review it weekly. And every time I do review it, there is the DEEP emotional pull that i want to, or SHOULD do something about one of those.

Two Questions if anyone is reading this
1. Is my realization on track with "Classic GTD"? I keep trying to follow the basics and keep finding it too cumbersome. This might help I think

2. how do you all strengthen yourself before you look at your someday maybe list for all the emotions it brings up? How do you stop yourself from trying to bring Someday Maybe things onto your list when you just don't have the space?

Thanks for any perspectives!
Wil
1-My project list includes everything that takes two or more next actions. And that I will complete in the next year. Someday maybe are longer term or just dream things to do. I find some don’t interest me anymore and some become more important. Cumbersome? It may be you are not simplifying your system enough. I find that many people here have really complex systems. I think they work more on the system than getting things done. I also really use this for everything. Very simple projects are on my list. My project list currently has 57 items on it. All will be done in a year. Some are more urgent than others. I have the very next action on a context list so I can pick it up right where I need to.
2- Tell yourself “No”. You are allowed. If it brings up emotion, you probably haven’t processed it in a way that it is off your mind. GTD is designed so you don’t feel guilty about what you aren’t doing. And in the moment for the things you are.
 
2. how do you all strengthen yourself before you look at your someday maybe list for all the emotions it brings up? How do you stop yourself from trying to bring Someday Maybe things onto your list when you just don't have the space?
My Someday/Maybe is divided into many, many lists. Books to Read, Sewing Ideas, Garden Ideas, Decluttering Ideas, Finance Ideas, Cooking Ideas, blah blah blah. There is a "misc" but if there are, say, more than four similar things in Misc, then I create a new list.

The lists are reviewed based on what they are. This includes some (many!) lists never being reviewed.

For example, two/three/five? years ago I decided that I wanted to focus on finishing the first draft of a novel, so I postponed sewing, photography, and at least three other hobbies that I don't even remember. I haven't deleted their lists, but I don't review them, ever.

I only review Books to Read if I'm out of books to read, which is very nearly never--my drive to pick up a new book usually comes before I actually need to look at the list.

I might glance at Cooking Ideas at holiday times (like, now) to see if there's anything I've been really wanting to try. (This is different from the active project called Keep Us Fed, where I may enter actions for an actual identified new recipe to try.)

And so on. I see no need to read through, and grieve, stuff that I won't be doing any time soon. I have a focus--getting through the second and then third draft of that novel--and that'll do.

Which I suppose is another possible piece of advice: Pick one, then see what fits around that one. The "one" is far more likely to get done, and there's a lot of satisfaction in getting one thing done versus thrashing around with a zillion intentions. In my case, gardening was compatible with writing, while those other hobbies weren't.

Of course, there's the fear that the one won't succeed, and thus the fear that you wasted all that energy. Is this novel likely to get published--regular, traditional, agent-sells-to-publisher published? No. It's not. (Neither is whatever I write next, though the odds might be higher with each novel.) But the possibility is important enough to me for me to give it a try.
 
I'm now 40 years old , and finally realizing that i can't do everything.
Get used to it. I'm LOTS older than you and I have things that I now can't do never mind the time they would take.

All those dream project I keep trying to shove into my calendar, I'll never get to do.

So they all have to go on my someday maybe list. But that list is already so long I can't possibly review it weekly.
So don't review it weekly. I too found that the pull of the projects I want to do but realistically can't now and maybe never was strong. So I limit major changes to 4 times a year, on the solstices and equinoxes. I wait to deal with my S/M lists (currently I have 83 S/M lists) until then. I am often pleasantly surprised that some projects have been done and completed without me ever referring to the S/M lists. And some are now, with the additional time, no longer important and can be deleted. A few make the grade to come into the current system, many more stay on the lists but are still in the "not Now" phase.

how do you all strengthen yourself before you look at your someday maybe list for all the emotions it brings up? How do you stop yourself from trying to bring Someday Maybe things onto your list when you just don't have the space?

I stretch out my quarterly/12WY review over a week. I would love to do a personal retreat, in a place of solitude and spend a weekend there but realistically that's not going to happen now, if ever. I typically try to spend about 3 hours per day on this deep dive into my system. So I plan my review week sort of like this. This is a rough plan and it can change but I try to cover all these pieces.

Day 1 - Clear my desk and space so I have room to pull out stuff from archives, reference, etc. as I need them. I work from neatly organized stacks (it looks messy but there is a structure) so first task is move all my stacks elsewhere. Collect large blank pieces of paper (I buy large cheap art canvas pads or even have gotten a roll of butcher paper and used that) and a bunch of multicolored pens. I also scrapbook so I have a bunch of both pens and pencils in all colors available to me. Clear ALL my inboxes down to zero even if it takes a long time. I want a clean slate to work on.

Day 2 - Reflect on what I did over the last quarter. Review my calendar, my journals, and notes or documents I made during the last quarter with created dates within the timeframe. I'm looking for what I did, what I accomplished, what went well, what didn’t go well. I use my large paper to write things down that seem especially relevant or important to me. I often use different colors for the general areas that they apply to. I review my personal purpose, and my list of areas of focus. I try to give an overall score of how I felt I did in each AOF and chart it out so I can see the trends. I compare this one to the ones in previous years for the same season. I chart them on a wheel so I can see if I am "well-rounded" in my work.

Day 3 - Look forward on my calendar for what is coming up. Is it spring and will I be dealing with shearing, lambing and irrigation start-up? Are there any planned visits from out of town guests? What do I know is coming up? Are there commitments I have made that I need time to prepare for?

Day 4 - Detailed in-depth review of all current projects. This is the time to really look at each one I am currently working on. Questions include, is this still necessary? Do I still want to do this? Can it continue to be worked on in the next 12 weeks? Are there constraints that mean I need to put it in mothballs for a while? Have I lost energy? If I want to keep it on my lists but I can't work on it now then I take the time to write a detailed breadcrumbs of the current state so future me can pick it up when the time is right without too much backtracking. I can usually remove 75% of my current projects during this phase.

Day 5 - Review my someday/maybe lists. As I said I have a lot of them. I start by looking at the lists for each major AOF. I try to start with the AOF that I did the worst in from Day 2. I often can’t give equal attention to each AOF over a season so if I neglected one last season I see what I can do about that for this one. As I look at projects I try to see if they still matter to me, If I think I can realistically ever do them, and then do I think I can do them this season. I will put far more on the list that I can accomplish in this stage. I used to re-write them all now I sometimes just make links in a MOC or TOC type document to notes that relate to those projects or copy and paste the summary into a single large document.

Day 6 - Prune the lists. For each project estimate the time I think I should devote to it and then add 50%. That gets me closer to reality.The figure on which ones have to go back into someday/maybe. Perhaps I can combine several projects into one simpler one? Or a whole group of related things will not be doable because of some resource that is lacking, like money or time, or a tool or access to people or equipment I need. I try to build in about 25% of my time as undefined to handle the new projects and changes that invariably happen. after I make my plan.

Day 7 - Put it all together. Order the projects in a way that makes sense. If any projects are dependent on other projects put them in an on-hold status with links so that when the predecessor project is done the next one automatically becomes available. Clean up my tasks and make sure that all project support material is collected and readily available. I'lI often make folders for projects to serve as a holding place for digital info and then complement it with a paper folder for paper resources. Add the next action to my context lists. I do a wrap up at the end with a quick and simple read through all my projects to be sure I haven’t missed anything.

When I'm done I know I have a clear plan of action for the next 12 weeks and I am starting fresh with a new 12 week year ahead of me. It takes a lot of time but it's worth it.
 
Get used to it. I'm LOTS older than you and I have things that I now can't do never mind the time they would take.
[...]

When I'm done I know I have a clear plan of action for the next 12 weeks and I am starting fresh with a new 12 week year ahead of me. It takes a lot of time but it's worth it.
Was I wrong when I wrote that @Oogiem is more inspiring? ;)
 
This thread is starting to help a REALLY big realization . I have SO many "War and Peace" examples on my lists.

I'm now 40 years old , and finally realizing that i can't do everything. I can only do about 9 projects at a time. 3 Personal Life, 3 Business, 3 in my job.

That is because I have so many maintenance things, things that have to happen daily or weekly or monthly in each of those area's. And my need for some kind of undefined time in my life so i don't loose my mind.

All of this means, my worst fears are true, that I can't do it all. All those dream project I keep trying to shove into my calendar, I'll never get to do.

So they all have to go on my someday maybe list. But that list is already so long I can't possibly review it weekly. And every time I do review it, there is the DEEP emotional pull that i want to, or SHOULD do something about one of those.

Two Questions if anyone is reading this
1. Is my realization on track with "Classic GTD"? I keep trying to follow the basics and keep finding it too cumbersome. This might help I think

2. how do you all strengthen yourself before you look at your someday maybe list for all the emotions it brings up? How do you stop yourself from trying to bring Someday Maybe things onto your list when you just don't have the space?

Thanks for any perspectives!
Wil

My Horizons of Focus help a lot with this.

Mine focus more on things like the way I show up in the world, the quality of my relationships and the lifestyle I want to live. There is a sprinkling of things I want to accomplish or items I would like to acquire in my horizons of focus, but the focus is mostly on the sort of person I am and the lifestyle I lead.

Of course, there is more that I might like to do than will ever be possible in one lifetime, but that's OK. My Someday/Maybe list is a menu of ideas to choose from that I can use to keep living the rich and rewarding life I am living.
 
Get used to it. I'm LOTS older than you and I have things that I now can't do never mind the time they would take.


So don't review it weekly. I too found that the pull of the projects I want to do but realistically can't now and maybe never was strong. So I limit major changes to 4 times a year, on the solstices and equinoxes. I wait to deal with my S/M lists (currently I have 83 S/M lists) until then. I am often pleasantly surprised that some projects have been done and completed without me ever referring to the S/M lists. And some are now, with the additional time, no longer important and can be deleted. A few make the grade to come into the current system, many more stay on the lists but are still in the "not Now" phase.



I stretch out my quarterly/12WY review over a week. I would love to do a personal retreat, in a place of solitude and spend a weekend there but realistically that's not going to happen now, if ever. I typically try to spend about 3 hours per day on this deep dive into my system. So I plan my review week sort of like this. This is a rough plan and it can change but I try to cover all these pieces.

Day 1 - Clear my desk and space so I have room to pull out stuff from archives, reference, etc. as I need them. I work from neatly organized stacks (it looks messy but there is a structure) so first task is move all my stacks elsewhere. Collect large blank pieces of paper (I buy large cheap art canvas pads or even have gotten a roll of butcher paper and used that) and a bunch of multicolored pens. I also scrapbook so I have a bunch of both pens and pencils in all colors available to me. Clear ALL my inboxes down to zero even if it takes a long time. I want a clean slate to work on.

Day 2 - Reflect on what I did over the last quarter. Review my calendar, my journals, and notes or documents I made during the last quarter with created dates within the timeframe. I'm looking for what I did, what I accomplished, what went well, what didn’t go well. I use my large paper to write things down that seem especially relevant or important to me. I often use different colors for the general areas that they apply to. I review my personal purpose, and my list of areas of focus. I try to give an overall score of how I felt I did in each AOF and chart it out so I can see the trends. I compare this one to the ones in previous years for the same season. I chart them on a wheel so I can see if I am "well-rounded" in my work.

Day 3 - Look forward on my calendar for what is coming up. Is it spring and will I be dealing with shearing, lambing and irrigation start-up? Are there any planned visits from out of town guests? What do I know is coming up? Are there commitments I have made that I need time to prepare for?

Day 4 - Detailed in-depth review of all current projects. This is the time to really look at each one I am currently working on. Questions include, is this still necessary? Do I still want to do this? Can it continue to be worked on in the next 12 weeks? Are there constraints that mean I need to put it in mothballs for a while? Have I lost energy? If I want to keep it on my lists but I can't work on it now then I take the time to write a detailed breadcrumbs of the current state so future me can pick it up when the time is right without too much backtracking. I can usually remove 75% of my current projects during this phase.

Day 5 - Review my someday/maybe lists. As I said I have a lot of them. I start by looking at the lists for each major AOF. I try to start with the AOF that I did the worst in from Day 2. I often can’t give equal attention to each AOF over a season so if I neglected one last season I see what I can do about that for this one. As I look at projects I try to see if they still matter to me, If I think I can realistically ever do them, and then do I think I can do them this season. I will put far more on the list that I can accomplish in this stage. I used to re-write them all now I sometimes just make links in a MOC or TOC type document to notes that relate to those projects or copy and paste the summary into a single large document.

Day 6 - Prune the lists. For each project estimate the time I think I should devote to it and then add 50%. That gets me closer to reality.The figure on which ones have to go back into someday/maybe. Perhaps I can combine several projects into one simpler one? Or a whole group of related things will not be doable because of some resource that is lacking, like money or time, or a tool or access to people or equipment I need. I try to build in about 25% of my time as undefined to handle the new projects and changes that invariably happen. after I make my plan.

Day 7 - Put it all together. Order the projects in a way that makes sense. If any projects are dependent on other projects put them in an on-hold status with links so that when the predecessor project is done the next one automatically becomes available. Clean up my tasks and make sure that all project support material is collected and readily available. I'lI often make folders for projects to serve as a holding place for digital info and then complement it with a paper folder for paper resources. Add the next action to my context lists. I do a wrap up at the end with a quick and simple read through all my projects to be sure I haven’t missed anything.

When I'm done I know I have a clear plan of action for the next 12 weeks and I am starting fresh with a new 12 week year ahead of me. It takes a lot of time but it's worth it.
@Oogiem

Good GTD post

Meanwhile, your GTD system has the honor of being appropriately prepared/in-sync with the arriving Winter Solstice and everything is crispy fresh for 2025 as a bonus !

Thank you very much
 
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War and Peace as a next action feels overwhelming, but breaking it down helps! Start with a project like 'ReadWar and Peace' and set your next action as 'Read Chapter 1.' You can track progress in chunks rather than the 40-hour marathon. It's easier to build momentum that way!
 
War and Peace as a next action feels overwhelming, but breaking it down helps! Start with a project like 'ReadWar and Peace' and set your next action as 'Read Chapter 1.' You can track progress in chunks rather than the 40-hour marathon. It's easier to build momentum that way!
@lewis814

Thank you very much for your post

Any "next action [that] feels overwhelming" might actually, in real reality, not be a Next Action ?


Perhaps better to focus on that which David Allen very kindly pointed out:

". . . a next action does not need to be short. Just no prior activity required to continue with it."

To be accepted as crispy clear GTD concept worth permeating throughout your personal GTD system ?

Thank you very much

As you see GTD fit. . . .
 
Great question, one that I have been thinking a lot about.
I agree with David, you really need to plan to the level that it takes it off your mind.
I have a book I'm reading, I leave it on my bedside table and I've committed to reading a minimum of one chapter a night before going to sleep. I didn't even add it to my lists as its location is sufficient reminder, and the habit is enough to take it off my mind.

However I have many work next actions which will take many hours, for example I had an action to create a team project list in Excel. This I know will take longer than half a day, as collectively we have over 100 projects that we are working on. Does this take it off my mind - NO. Does the description repel me as it seems too overwhelming - YES. Therefore I decided to break it down into a smaller next actions - creating themes for projects, reviewing the layout etc. Basically I did the natural planning model and kept breaking it down into smaller steps that felt achievable.
Generally I have done this a lot at work and have mostly found that tasks feel achievable when they can be completed in half a day or 4 hours or less. Anything longer and it tends to repel me from working on it. So instead of 'draft presentation' I might have 'collect information for presentation'. The important thing is you keep rephrasing it until it feels like something you can and will do.
 
Great question, one that I have been thinking a lot about.
I agree with David, you really need to plan to the level that it takes it off your mind.
I have a book I'm reading, I leave it on my bedside table and I've committed to reading a minimum of one chapter a night before going to sleep. I didn't even add it to my lists as its location is sufficient reminder, and the habit is enough to take it off my mind.

However I have many work next actions which will take many hours, for example I had an action to create a team project list in Excel. This I know will take longer than half a day, as collectively we have over 100 projects that we are working on. Does this take it off my mind - NO. Does the description repel me as it seems too overwhelming - YES. Therefore I decided to break it down into a smaller next actions - creating themes for projects, reviewing the layout etc. Basically I did the natural planning model and kept breaking it down into smaller steps that felt achievable.
Generally I have done this a lot at work and have mostly found that tasks feel achievable when they can be completed in half a day or 4 hours or less. Anything longer and it tends to repel me from working on it. So instead of 'draft presentation' I might have 'collect information for presentation'. The important thing is you keep rephrasing it until it feels like something you can and will do.
@Suelin23

Thank you for your post

Great insights:
". . . natural planning model and kept breaking it down into smaller steps that felt achievable."
"have mostly found that tasks feel achievable when they can be completed in half a day or 4 hours or less. Anything longer . . . repel me. . . . "
"So instead of 'draft presentation' I might have 'collect information for presentation'."

Huge:
"The important thing is you keep rephrasing it until it feels like something you can and will do."

Thank you very much
 
Say I've decided I want to read Tolstoy's War and Peace.

I captured "Read War and Peace" in my inbox, and now it's time to Clarify.

Read something - that definitely sounds like an action to me, but it's a big book - 1500+ pages and a reading time of about 40 hours. Definitely not less than two minutes, so I'm not going to read it now.

That's a whole work week! Can a "Next action" take 40 hours? I definitely won't do it in one sitting.

Should I open a "War and Peace" project? There are 361 chapters. Maybe I can make each chapter a step, then I'll have a 361-step project.

But wait - what if I read a chapter a night? Stuff happens, so I'll probably only be able to read 5 nights a week, and that puts it at over a year - that mean's I can't make it a project!

Do I make reading War and Peace an Area of Responsibility? Seems kind of silly. I'm overwhelmed, so I think I'll put it in Someday/Maybe.

Thoughts?

Ah, reading for pleasure. In my experience, pleasure reading is best dealt with using Occam's Razor (the simplest and most efficient way to get from here to success). In David terms, we need to have a "mind like water" about it. Respond to it as it is.

You could put each chapter on a next action list, make it a responsibility, create a dedicated routine. All of those things are technically valid options.

Or. You could use a mind like water, as David recommends, and consider that the book already has a next actions list built into it (list of chapters) and your bookmark will indicate to you where you are in the process of completing it. The action of "read the book" doesn't need to be written on a next action list*, because the book itself IS a next action list.

If it doesn't need to be written on an action list, how do we keep track of it in our GTD system?

Since it's quite possible it will take over a year to complete, taking it out of the running to be a Project, you could totally put it on your Horizon 2 - Areas of Focus/Accountability/Responsibility List. It doesn't have a set end date, so it doesn't belong on Horizon 3 - Goals. It isn't necessarily an area of accountability or responsibility either because the outcome of finishing it doesn't affect anything else except perhaps your personal fulfilment & achievement on a relatively informal level. Calling it an Area of Focus makes the most sense because you want to give it the attention it deserves, but not make too much of a fuss about it (again, mind like water).

Ok, we've written it down as an Area of Focus, we've acknowledged that it has a built in Next Actions list, and we have a physical bookmark to know where we're up to with completing the Next Actions, so now we need to look at our limitations to getting it done.

Context, Time Available, and Resources.

The simplest way to embrace the limitations of reading it would be to put the book* (resource, with built in NA list) where you plan to read it (context). Then, when you have the wild hair (time available) to read, you sit down and voila!, use the bookmark to pick up with your immediate next action in the process of reading War and Peace.

If your intuition tells you that you won't naturally find yourself with the available time to leisurely sit in your reading chair, then take charge of the (time available) limitation by make an appointment/meeting with yourself to read, which will go in your Calendar because appointments/meetings are time sensitive.

If you find that you leave it off your calendar for a few weeks because things get busy, you can be assured that it will show up again because it is on your Areas of Focus/Accountability/Responsibility list that you glance at every week during your Weekly Review. And, because the physical book is located in the appropriate context, you will see it regularly and be reminded that it contains a Next Action list, complete with bookmark, ready for you to get back to.

Don't forget how important a mind like water is to this process. If it feels like you're having to do too much work to make it work, take a second to consider whether you're feeling resistance because the "defining" work (in this case the creation of a Next Actions List & "reading system") has already been done.

I was profoundly moved by War and Peace, btw. I Highly recommend reading it.

*Note - I acknowledge that not everyone reads physical books these days. If that's you, and you also have a digital GTD system, which alters the context from a reading chair to anywhere you decide to read, then make a faux placeholder NA or Project in your digital system labeled, "Read War and Peace" which will prompt you to go to the book, where the book's chapter (NA) list and your bookmark will guide you to your actual Next Action. I do encourage you to consider reading the physical book in this particular case, though. It's quite an experience.
 
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